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There used to be all these rules. You're

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not supposed to write for clarinets

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because they're in the vocal range.

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Well, if you I don't think I sound like

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a clarinet. I don't think I sound like a

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clarinet. Um, so I I I think

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just just just be a little bit mindful.

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I mean, a lot of these rules about how

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we're supposed to circumn dialogue come

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from the days before, you know, I have

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the picture running when I'm writing and

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I pop the dialogue up and I can see if I

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can understand every word, you know,

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they come from the time before pu people

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actually had, you know, they had a movie

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if they were lucky and but they

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couldn't, you know, they couldn't think

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it did didn't matter their piano playing

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to the dialogue. It wasn't until they

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unleashed the orchestra that they found

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out that

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it's all a bit loud and a bit, you know,

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stepping all over the dialogue. Most

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screenwriters,

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if they're any good, will pick just the

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right words and just the right amount of

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words to get that story across. So, as a

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composer, you got to do the same thing.

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Don't pick too many words. Don't pick

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the wrong words. It's just, you know,

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what what's the what's the story you're

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trying to convey right now? And it

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doesn't matter if an actor is speaking

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or if it's a well, it doesn't matter if

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it's a car chase because nothing new can

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happen till the car chase is over

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anyway. So, and nobody can hear anything

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other than the roaring of cars. Um, you

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know, look, it's back to the same

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argument or the same thing I've been

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saying all along. Be mindful of the

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story. So if if you're getting in the

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way of the story which is being told by

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the character, you're doing something

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wrong. Um if if you are on story, if you

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just stick with story, stick on story.

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Um

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that's your safety net. You know, it

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doesn't matter that you've just written

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the nicest and most beautiful piece of

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music of your career. If it interferes

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with the story, bin it, chuck it, throw

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it in the trash.

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You know, the the the Sherlock stuff is

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actually strange because it was it was a

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bit of an oopsy not having everything

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this close, recording everything this

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close and not giving it perspective. So

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that it became really tough in the, you

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know, on the dummy engineer and you just

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want to have real masters working it. Um

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because uh

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quite simply I think it's it's not the

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size of the orchestra or the amount of

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noise you make that gets in the way. Um

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if your dialogue is close, if your

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character is close to you or whatever

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and unclear

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and you mic your orchestra in the right

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way, perspective is just as effective as

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turning the volume down. So um

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I I think a lot about the perspective of

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the scene, you know, where I want to

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have the players placed in relationship

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to the uh to the actors in a way, but

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it's not necessarily

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about volume. It's it is about

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perspective. So if if if you can make

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sure that your orchestra or your

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musician sound further away, your your

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ear will automatically go to the the the

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clear closely miked thing. I mean, you

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know, there it's

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you're about 9 milliseconds away from me

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right now. You know, you're not in real

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time because of the distance between the

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two of us. So if I record at Abby Road

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or at Air or any of the halls that I

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like recording at, you know, there's a

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a fair distance between the orchestra

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and and where the mics get hit, you

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know, so uh that's an automatic thing.

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And then I can go and push things

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further away by adding, you know, adding

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more room and and you know, very quickly

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you actually lose the sense of how close

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things are. And and the other nice thing

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of course is when you have mics further

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away even in a dry room um the the air

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absorbs the high frequencies. So there's

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a sort of a natural beautiful roll off

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that happens and that just you know uh

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lets the voice through. So if you record

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everything really close, in other words,

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you do not have that natural roll off

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like some people might have done in

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Sherlock Holmes, um you yeah, you're

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going to land yourself in a world of

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trouble.

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Sound has changed, you know, it's we're

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we're not in in the mono world where it

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comes out of one little speaker anymore.

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And you do have to sort of you have to

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make a decision at a certain point about

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how you're going to approach things. Um

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I mean I I find this this happens to us

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on the Chris Nolan movies all the time

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where um we get berated for the music

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being too loud in Interstellar and that

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you can't hear the dialogue and and

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people keep forgetting Chris is not only

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the director of this film, he's the

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writer of this film, it's his dialogue.

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he could do with it what he wants. And

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if sometimes he thinks that the music

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creates, you know, creates a better

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narrative or explains or says something

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that he prefers to hear notes as opposed

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to words, then, you know, he can do

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this. But

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the point is,

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don't be shy about

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being, you know, being ballsy on the

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dialogue as well. that it's a huge big

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screen and you you you hope that you're

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going to have a great huge wonderful

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sound system to listen to it on. Or you

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can go the other way and you can say,

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"Well, I'm I'm just going to go and

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write for the worst cinema experience I

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can possibly think of, which is some

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screen where all the speakers are blown

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except for the left hand corner tweeter.

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Aim upwards. hope that the hope that

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this movie is going to get shown only in

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cinemas where the sound is wonderful and

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if the sound isn't wonderful um don't

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blame us. We really did do a good job

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and we really sat there and you know we

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weren't haphazard. We're not random. We

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spend an enormous amount of time making

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sure that you can hear everything you're

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supposed to be hearing and therefore I'm

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going to be really really cautious. But

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my attitude is they all know we're

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working really really hard and we're

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trying to make it sound really good and

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we're trying to make it comprehensible.

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And yeah, the last thing you want to do

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is not let people have the information

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um that that they need. But not all the

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information is always conveyed in

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dialogue. It's not necessary that that

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it's always just dialogue

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um that that gives you the right

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information. Sometimes it's sound,

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sometimes it's music, sometimes it's

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silence.

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This is all part of the game. You You

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try to figure out an interesting way of

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how to coexist with the dialogue, how to

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be quiet. I bet you there are a lot of

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people who go, "Oh my god, it's a

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dialogue scene. I got to go and write

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the dialogue. All I'm going to do is be

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like some pad underneath the dialogue.

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doesn't have to be. That can be

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something really interesting. It's it's

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teamwork. I mean, it's it's it's you you

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you can't just say, "Oh, it's scoring

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under dialogue." I mean, if if if if

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you're dealing with an actor with a soft

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voice um or not a very strong voice,

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yeah, it's going to be probably a little

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bit more problematic than if if you're

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dealing with Jack Nichols and all just

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like, you know, as somebody who

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projects, somebody who really knows how

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to do it. And then it be it really does

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become teamwork is where the

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circumstances. Okay, I'll give you uh

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great example um

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Dark Knight Rises. We have a scene

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between Batman and Bane and they're

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having a big showdown and

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it's right in front of a waterfall, you

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know, visually perfect, but they're both

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wearing masks and it's in front of a

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waterfall. So there's a lot of a lot of

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the spectrum has been covered, you know,

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and it, you know, and

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Chris is absolutely legitimate in

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shooting the scene that way. Um,

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and you know, and and trusting us and

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the sound department, etc., to go and

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dig the dialogue out and and make it

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comprehensible.